Friday, February 25, 2011

【China AIDS:6285】 Fw:转发:Re: [NGO-ACTION(行动)] Fw:Re: [联席会议] 回复: 【LGBT邮件组】 想起老万 From thinking of Lao Wan

 
 
 
 
---------- 转发邮件信息 ----------
发件人:"douniwan_2011@sina.com"
发送日期:2011-02-25 08:44:04
收件人:tjgaga <tjgaga@googlegroups.com>
主题: 转发:Re: [NGO-ACTION(行动)] Fw:Re: [联席会议] 回复: 【LGBT邮件组】 想起老万 From thinking of Lao Wan

-------------- 原始邮件 --------------

"思"老万小孟上演苦情戏,"译"英文"代表"一箭射三雕

上回邮件说道:上届CCM选举,"梦(孟)之队"暗箱操作执掌社区,"万家军"中计败走美利坚。

不想风云突变,只见小孟子夜灯下,写下柔肠寸断思念老师的一封"情书",惹得我们浙江草根大虾也不由发自肺腑。感动得热泪盈眶,泪洒西湖啊!各位看官,如果你们手机里还有2009年短信留存的话,请删除这样一条短信配合一下咱小孟:

"请大家给福特基金会牛彩霞打电话010-65326668和给联合国艾滋病规划署范玉华电话010-85322226,要求停止和撤回对感染者联盟和爱之方舟等孟林可以支配的资助,以免资助款用于雇用杀手行凶。请行动起来!谢谢你! (发信人)万延海"。

按西湖草根大虾的话说:领袖也有柔情。只是小孟的柔情,额们永远不懂。有人说小孟是额们的"民主"斗士,一座偶像,以后谁再这样说,偶就跟谁急!啥偶像派,啥偶像派啊,这不是骂人么?孟代表是实力派、是演技派。偶见过演技好的,就没见过演技这么好的,我靠~

只是各位看官,老话说"外行看热闹,内行看门道",小孟含泪上演苦情戏真的是思念老师么?真担心咱老师到了美国,连中文都忘啦,所以很牛逼地居然写起了英文信。还用外语试图让社区人士弄明白,自家可没申请这全球鸡精。但俺们小孟这苦情戏哪有白演的?一场戏要起码搞定三只雕呢:

第一雕 搂钱 孟代表号称没有申请全球基金的这些个散钱,其实啊,人家可是瞄准着欧盟项目的600万大额呢,英文版啊就是给那些国外的慈善家看的------外国佬,你们知道么,俺可是和万老师一家的,你们不知道俺小孟名头,总得看几分万老薄面给俺批了这项目,俺缺钱啊,俺要开始"民主选举"啦!俺要和几个兄弟姐妹们一起转型"搞"中国人权啦。

第二雕 胁迫 不过,额们代表眼光可没这么短浅,才不至于这么单纯-----你就以为小孟只惦记着这些个项目 ,别说你不信,偶也不信,此信更有深意纳~

要知道老师何许人也?不是这么轻易可以被打跑的,当年选举,万老就是轻信了小孟的殷勤误中连环计。现在小孟又向某些机构放了一个信号弹:俺可是打万家军的有功之臣啊,不罩着俺,上届选举的幕后交易俺可要爆料啦。

不过,老师迎头就吐了口浓痰,根本没待见这水性杨花恶心样。啥个人恩怨啊,说啥呢,那会说老师利用攻击政府讨好外国人,这会自个儿连祖宗话也说不全了,要用自己还没搞懂的英文献媚了。各位看官,小孟显然只剩下抖包袱,爆料要挟以自保的份儿了-----某些驻华国际机构的某些人估计要开始紧张地抽疯了吧,不过对其他人来说,要抖搂就抖搂出来呗,让大伙儿开开眼,看看当年的水到底有多深!

第三雕 收编 留在联席会议的没来及清醒过来的草根小侠们,咱CCM"代表"这么"思念"一下万老师,你们就可以支持额们代表啦,你们没看见联席会议秘书处都忙着敲边鼓呢,准备将联席会议尽数收编到"梦之队"。瞧瞧西湖大虾都已经认娘了,你们也悉数认娘吧,跟着娘吃香喝辣去。俺给你们搞能力建设……

"这年头,真是不怕没恶心的事,就怕没恶心死你的极品,打着民主自由旗,号称做着公益慈善事,却颠倒黑白,绑着社区,要挟政府,陷害同僚,出卖战友,和这样的玩意儿活在同一个时代,同一个世界,同一个国家,同一个社区,真是做人的悲哀,悲哀死了。"

dandanzj2010

2011-02-25

dandanzj2010

发件人: 王月明
发送时间: 2011-02-23 21:47:25
收件人: tjgaga; NGO邮件组
抄送:
主题: [NGO-ACTION(行动)] Fw:Re: [联席会议] 回复: 【LGBT邮件组】 想起老万 From thinking of Lao Wan
---------- 转发邮件信息 ----------
发件人:""Wan Yanhai" <wanyanhai2010@hotmail.com>"
发送日期:2011-02-22 02:45:17
收件人:china_hiv_aids_cbo_network@googlegroups.com
主题: Re: [联席会议] 回复: 【LGBT邮件组】 想起老万 From thinking of Lao Wan
我和这个人有个人恩怨吗?这是个人恩怨吗?请不要用个人恩怨来谈论此类事情。我们要谈就谈一个具体的事情,大家愿意讨论问题,就来讨论。
在法庭上,一开始说话,就指责原告搞政治,利用攻击政府博取国外人的欢心。这是个人恩怨吗?这是法庭讲理的方式吗?
我在法庭上,发现有人带到法庭上陪同的家属,竟然是北京六轮的工作人员。原来,北京六轮最早的两名工作人员,不仅有原"同事",还有家属。
在我为民主和人权战斗的时候,我竟然被无数次、甚至在法庭上被攻击为攻击政府、讨取外国人欢心。而攻击我的行为竟然被描绘为"民主活动中的演练"。这个世界上还有是非原则吗?
我不拒绝竞争,也不拒绝合作,但我鄙视任何暴力的威胁和无耻。
我很惊讶,这样的一篇文字竟然用自己不熟悉的英语来表述,给谁看的呢?
万延海
From: 王龙
Sent: Monday, February 21, 2011 10:26 AM
Subject: [联席会议] 回复: 【LGBT邮件组】 想起老万 From thinking of Lao Wan

求大同、存小异,我们的世界将会更加光彩!

看了孟林这篇发自肺腑的文章,我很感动…。孟林几次和我提到的事,今天终于他自己说出来了,我佩服孟林的勇气,也佩服他的为人。

万老师和孟林都是我们的社区领袖,在不同的场合扮演着不同的角色。万老师是中国艾滋病领域的一面旗帜,他为中国的同性恋人群的反歧视、输血感染者和血友病人群的维权、中国感染者的生存、中国的人权做出了巨大的贡献。

孟林作为感染者,以他的艾滋病携带者联盟为平台,也为中国的感染者的政策倡导,药物倡导感染者的权利,发挥了巨大的作用,做了很多好事。同时他作为CCM非公委负责人,在全球基金的问题上,多次写信给全球基金总部,要求明确公民社会的定义,全球基金的资金必须20%以上用于社会组织,今年,这些问题都已得到解决,这里面也有非公委和感工委的一份功劳。

孟林和万老师都是中国艾滋病领域的社区领袖,他们的个人恩怨也会对社区组织带来负面影响,我在泰国和武汉几次为他们的关系协调,我的想法很单调,只要社区组织团结了,才会为社区组织带来更大的利益。作为社区组织领袖,中国的社区更需要他们的合作,求大同、存小异,我们的世界将会更加光彩!

王龙
中国艾滋病工作民间组织
全国联席会议秘书处负责人
浙江爱心工作组组长
电话:13758248793
浙江同志情感热线:
0571-85621855(每天19:30-22:00)
浙江爱心网:www.zjtzax.com
办公地址:杭州市刀茅巷103号


--- 11年2月20日,周日, 孟林 <menglin2801@gmail.com> 写道:

发件人: 孟林 <menglin2801@gmail.com>
主题: 【LGBT邮件组】 想起老万 From thinking of Lao Wan
收件人: "lgbt" <tjgaga@googlegroups.com>, menglin-PLWHAs@googlegroups.com, "cap+论坛" <china-plwha@googlegroups.com>
日期: 2011年2月20日,周日,上午12:30

See the English version below

不知为什么,最近总是感到孤独,又总是想起已经去美国的万延海老师。

在艾滋病圈内,很多人都知道我和万老师有些"积怨"。坦率地说,我确实不是很喜欢他这个人,相信他也一定不是很喜欢我,这当中应该有很多个人性格上的不合。在我们有限的几次直接交往中,我只清楚地记得好多年前,在泰国开会时,万老师请中国去的草根便餐,也邀上了我,席间有人提出希望我们俩握手言和,万老师说,我们俩如果合作了,那就要挨收拾了,我听了会心一笑,因为我们都知道这个"收拾"意味着什么。可能也因此,我们缺少了合作,但是在最根本的问题上我们还是有着最起码的战略默契和策应,比如说在针对政府内外腐朽势力的基本态度上。

其实,我在很多方面还是很佩服万老师的,关于这一点,却很少有人知道。我佩服他始终百折不挠、坚忍不拔地高举公民社会旗帜和捍卫人权的勇气;也佩服他常常能够敏锐地发现政府行政过程中存在的问题,在鼓励弱势人群维护权利方面,万老师也有所贡献。当然,这并不意味着我赞同他的所有做法,比如他在对待草根组织的态度上和在运用人权标准方面总是给我异样的感觉。对于老万的贡献,我其实经常在朋友中提起,熟悉我的人都是知道我态度的。

我进入公民社会领域时间不是很长,且是因着自己求生的欲望走进来的,所以最初根本就没有什么公民社会概念,也没有什么人权意识,只是自己想活下去而已。而恰恰是在这个过程中,在很多老师的教诲和帮助下,也包括与万老师的礼尚往来中,我渐渐认识到了活不下去的障碍,认识到了我不仅仅是一个艾滋病人,更是一个公民,也明白了一个人如果要想有尊严地活下去,只有依靠自己和公民社会的力量,正如《国际歌》中所唱的。

坦率地说,我走到今天,和与万老师的竞争有一定关系,我一直把这种竞争看成民主活动中的演练,这种竞争给我带来一种前所未有的快乐。而现在,他去了美国,这让我时常感到孤单,没有了博弈的乐趣。那感觉,有点像失恋,真的。

最近,因为新一轮全球基金CCM草根组织代表的选举,社区中再次充斥各种声音,其中对我也有批评,我对此坦然接受,觉得这是民主的一部分,有人愿意骂人,不管有理没理,我们都应该听着,这点宽容也是我从和万老师的竞争中学会的。当然这也的确让我感到孤独无助,回想自己前后在全球基金事务上搭进去了将近4年的时间,为了规避一些利益冲突,我所在的机构始终没有申请全球基金项目,也包括中盖项目和国家社会动员项目资金,我们没日没夜地赔钱赔时间赔精力干工作,而我们自己的组织却失去了很多发展的机会,我现在真的觉得很累很累,感到似乎是到了该收山的时候了。

眼下,为了国内各地草根组织能够获得更多的资金支持及可持续发展,我们这届CCM两工委已经成功地借助各种力量迫使全球基金暂停并进入整改,在这与各种政府内外腐朽势力艰难较量的过程中,我很希望社区的朋友们支持我们,也希望包括万老师在内的各位老师的指点和配合,我更希望社区中出现如万老师那般跟政府内外腐朽力量叫板的力量,热切地盼望着有更多社区人士展现出与这些腐朽力量叫板的决心和行动!

写到这里,我想,我终于想清了想念万老师的理由,我由衷地感谢他曾经给我的鞭策,哪怕是责骂。无论如何,我都不能否认自己从万老师身上学到了很多很多东西,它们使我有机会较为深入地参与到艾滋病防治和全球基金事务中来,也使我灰暗的人生多了一点点亮丽,因此,我在此也为自己当年的一些不理智的言行向万老师表示歉意。我真心祝愿远在美国的万老师多多保重,机会成熟就早些回到祖国来,更希望有机会与你一道并肩作战。

From thinking of Lao Wan

I do not know why I always feel lonely recently and always think of Wan Yanhai who had already been in the USA nowadays.

In the HIV/AIDS circle in China, many people know I had some "piled-up grievance" with Wan. Frankly, I really don't like him as a person and I also believe that he for sure doesn't like me. There must be something not matchable in our personal characters. Among our limited direct contacts, I can only remember that many years ago when I was in Thailand for a meeting, Wan invited us from Chinese grassroots groups for dinner. In the dinner, someone suggested that we could forgive and forget the hatchets. Wan replied that if we could have cooperated we would then be "cleared away". I heard it and smiled with tactic understanding since we all knew the meaning of the "cleared away". It might be the reason that we actually have no cooperation. But I know that for the most fundamental issue, we still have the basic strategic understanding and coordinated action, for example, in the basic attitude toward the corrupted forces within and outside the government.

In fact, I actually admire Wan in many aspects, in this aspect I think very few people know about it. I admire his courage to always hold the flag of civil society and safeguard the human rights with perseverance and insistence; I also admire that he had the smart vision to sensitively find out the problems in the administration of the government. In the encouragement of the disadvantaged populations to protect their rights, Wan also contributed a lot. For course, these admirations do not mean that I agree with all of his actions, for instance his attitude in dealing with grassroots organizations and his application of human rights criteria always made me feel unusual. As for Wan's contribution, I actually often mentioned among my friends. Many of my close friends know about it.

I had very short time in the field of civil society. Also I entered into this field due to my survival desire. So in the beginning period, I know nothing about civil society nor the concept of human rights. I was here just for survival. During this process, I was lucky to have some instructions and help from so many teachers, including the courtesy demands reciprocity with Wan. I then generally understand the obstacles stopping me from survival and got to know that I am not just a person living with HIV but a citizen. I later understand if we want to live with dignity we could only rely on ourselves and the force of civil society as it is sung in <the Internationale>.

Frankly, the reason I went today had some connection with the competition with Wan but I always take it as a kind of democratic practice and really enjoy the unprecedented pleasure from it. But now he is away in USA, that made me really feel lonely. I have no pleasure of competition. It is really like lovesick, really.

Recently, due to the coming election of the Global Fund CCM grassroots organization representative, we are in the environment with all kinds of comments again, among them there are also critics to me. I accept them calmly and do feel this is part of the democracy. If someone wants to curse people, no matter it is reasonable or not, we have to listen. I can feel the tolerance is coming from the competition with Wan. Well of course they also made me feel lonely and helpless. I recalled that for the Global Fund I invested about four years in it. In order to avoid the interest of conflicts, the organization that I am in has not applied any projects to the Global Fund, as well as the Gates Foundation and the Social Mobilization Program, all along. We spend our money, our time and our energy to work but lost a lot of chances to develop our own organization. Now I really feel very very tired and also feel it might be the moment to stop.

Right now, in order to create more chances for grassroots organizations across the country to get more money support and sustainable development opportunities, the current CCM NGO working committee and CCM PLWHA Working Committee had successively mobilize all kinds of forces to suspend the implementation of the Global Fund RCC in China and let them change their policy and working approaches. During the hard contesting process with the corrupted forces within and outside the government system, I really expect the friends from our community could support us and more and more instructions and advices from our respected teachers including Wan could support us. I hope more and more people like Wan who could fight against the corrupted forces within and outside the government system will be emerging and more decisive actions could be carried out!

When I am writing here, I believe I am finally clear why I think of Wan. I sincerely thank him for his spurn even scolding on me. In any case, I can not deny that I learnt a lot from Wan that make me get involved deeply in the HIV prevention and treatment as well as in the Global Fund affairs. They also shine more light and color in my dark life. Therefore, here I would like to express my apology to Teacher Wan for my improper word and behavior and wish Wan take care in USA. Once the moment arrive, wish you come back to your motherland and expect the moment to fight side by side with you.

--
您收到的是来自[LGBT]邮件组的消息:
[LGBT]邮件组是为从事相关领域工作的组织和机构相互交流和发布公共讯息而建立,邮件组成员不分地域、背景和工作职务。
★:要在此论坛发帖,请发电子邮件到 tjgaga@googlegroups.com
★:要加入:请发信至 tjgaga@gmail.com
★:要退订此论坛,请发邮件至 tjgaga-unsubscribe@googlegroups.com
★:联系人: 嘎嘎 13389902898 QQ:100083866
LGBT是首字母缩写词:
女同性恋者(Lesbians) 男同性恋者(Gays) 双性恋者(Bisexuals) 跨性别者(Transgender)

--
您收到此邮件是因为您订阅了 Google 网上论坛的"中国艾滋病工作民间组织全国(工作网络)联席会议邮件组"论坛。
要向此网上论坛发帖,请发送电子邮件至 china_hiv_aids_cbo_network@googlegroups.com
要取消订阅此网上论坛,请发送电子邮件至 china_hiv_aids_cbo_network+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com
若有更多问题,请通过 http://groups.google.com/group/china_hiv_aids_cbo_network?hl=zh-CN 访问此网上论坛。

--
您收到此邮件是因为您订阅了 Google 网上论坛的"中国艾滋病工作民间组织全国(工作网络)联席会议邮件组"论坛。
要向此网上论坛发帖,请发送电子邮件至 china_hiv_aids_cbo_network@googlegroups.com
要取消订阅此网上论坛,请发送电子邮件至 china_hiv_aids_cbo_network+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com
若有更多问题,请通过 http://groups.google.com/group/china_hiv_aids_cbo_network?hl=zh-CN 访问此网上论坛。


--
1、您收到此信息是由于您订阅了"NGO Action"listserv(非政府组织行动邮件组)。

2、要在此论坛发帖,请发电子邮件到 NGO-Action@googlegroups.com,要退订此论坛,请发邮件至 NGO-Action-unsubscribe@googlegroups.com。您也可以通过 http://groups.google.com/group/NGO-Action?hl=en 访问该论坛。

--
您收到的是来自[LGBT]邮件组的消息:
[LGBT]邮件组是为从事相关领域工作的组织和机构相互交流和发布公共讯息而建立,邮件组成员不分地域、背景和工作职务。
★:要在此论坛发帖,请发电子邮件到 tjgaga@googlegroups.com
★:要加入:请发信至 tjgaga@gmail.com
★:要退订此论坛,请发邮件至 tjgaga-unsubscribe@googlegroups.com
★:联系人: 嘎嘎 13389902898 QQ:100083866
LGBT是首字母缩写词:
女同性恋者(Lesbians) 男同性恋者(Gays) 双性恋者(Bisexuals) 跨性别者(Transgender)

--
您收到的是来自[LGBT]邮件组的消息:
[LGBT]邮件组是为从事相关领域工作的组织和机构相互交流和发布公共讯息而建立,邮件组成员不分地域、背景和工作职务。
★:要在此论坛发帖,请发电子邮件到 tjgaga@googlegroups.com
★:要加入:请发信至 tjgaga@gmail.com
★:要退订此论坛,请发邮件至 tjgaga-unsubscribe@googlegroups.com
★:联系人: 嘎嘎 13389902898 QQ:100083866
LGBT是首字母缩写词:
女同性恋者(Lesbians) 男同性恋者(Gays) 双性恋者(Bisexuals) 跨性别者(Transgender)

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★艾博法律热线(AIBO Law Hotline):15501137876
――为艾滋病受影响人群就业、就医和隐私保护权益提供法律咨询服务
 
★China Youth HIV/AIDS Assembly (CYHAA) 共享网盘:http://oeo.la/I4gf8
-~----------~----~----~----~-
"China AIDS Group中国艾滋病网络"
A:论坛发帖,请发电子邮件到 chinaaidsgroup@googlegroups.com
B:退订此论坛,请发邮件至 chinaaidsgroup-unsubscribe@googlegroups.com
C:Contact: Chang Kun 13349108944 changkun2010@gmail.com
 
★:
――艾博维客 AIDS Wiki : http://www.AIDSwiki.org
――艾博聚合(艾滋病博客群
http://www.wanyanhai.org
――China AIDS Email Group with over 2400 members:http://chinaaidsgroup.blogspot.com
――中国艾滋病地图/China AIDS Map:http://www.AIDSmaps.org
――空腹健身运动:http://www.HungerStrikeforAIDS.org
――艾滋人权 AIDS Rights: http://www.AIDSrights.net
――为艾滋病防治努力一生:Http://www.changkun.org
★ 凡是挑�、��、非理性、�於情�性、胡�批�和�意�之言�,或是匿名人士之言�,以及所�表意�出�有不雅、粗鄙之文字等,本�件��不予以�示!

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